47

IEEE floating point numbers have a bit assigned to indicate the sign, which means you can technically have different binary representations of zero (+0 and -0). Is there an arithmetic operation I could do for example in C which result in a negative zero floating point value?

This question is inspired by another which called into question whether you can safely compare 0.0f using ==, and I wondered further if there is are other ways to represent zero which would cause float1 == 0.0f to break for seemingly perfectly equal values.

[Edit] Please, do not comment about the safety of comparing floats for equality! I am not trying to add to that overflowing bucket of duplicate questions.

3
  • 6
    Even more interesting is NaN. NaN compares not equal to all values, including itself! Feb 23, 2011 at 19:36
  • "Is there an arithmetic operation I could do for example in C which result in a negative zero floating point value?" - Possibly C is a bad example, since C doesn't guarantee that its floating-point types are IEEE floats. As far as the C standard is concerned there's no portable way to guarantee generating a negative zero, but there are operations for which the implementation is permitted to generate a negative zero. There's also a way for an implementation to advertise that its floats in fact are IEEE floats, in which case game on. Feb 23, 2011 at 20:53
  • Please provide link to "another question whether you can safely compare 0.0f using ==" Sep 16, 2011 at 7:45

10 Answers 10

38

According to the standard, negative zero exists but it is equal to positive zero. For almost all purposes, the two behave the same way and many consider the existence of a negative to be an implementation detail. There are, however, some functions that behave quite differently, namely division and atan2:

#include <math.h>
#include <stdio.h>

int main() {
    double x = 0.0;
    double y = -0.0;
    printf("%.08f == %.08f: %d\n", x, y, x == y);
    printf("%.08f == %.08f: %d\n", 1 / x, 1 / y, 1 / x == 1 / y);
    printf("%.08f == %.08f: %d\n", atan2(x, y), atan2(y, y), atan2(x, y) == atan2(y, y));
}

The result from this code is:

0.00000000 == -0.00000000: 1
1.#INF0000 == -1.#INF0000: 0
3.14159265 == -3.14159265: 0

This would mean that code would correctly handle certain limits without a need for explicit handling. It's not certain that relying on this feature for values close to the limits is a good idea, since a simple calculation error can change the sign and make the value far from correct, but you can still take advantage of it if you avoid calculations that would change the sign.

1
  • 5
    Can you cite a standard reference?
    – M.M
    Jun 29, 2015 at 23:59
16

Is there an arithmetic operation I could do for example in C which result in a negative zero floating point value?

Sure:

float negativeZero = -10.0e-30f * 10.0e-30f;

The mathematically precise result of the multiplication is not representable as a floating-point value, so it rounds to the closest representable value, which is -0.0f.

The semantics of negative zero are well defined by the IEEE-754 standard; the only real observable way in which its behavior differs from that of zero in arithmetic expression is that if you divide by it, you will get a different sign of infinity. For example:

1.f /  0.f --> +infinity
1.f / -0.f --> -infinity

Comparisons and addition and subtraction with -0.f give the same result as they would with +0.f (in the default rounding mode). Multiplication can preserve the sign of zero, but as noted, it generally isn't observable.

There are some math library functions whose behavior can vary depending on the sign of zero. For example:

copysignf(1.0f, 0.0f) -->  1.0f
copysignf(1.0f,-0.0f) --> -1.0f

This is more common in the complex functions:

csqrtf(-1.0f + 0.0f*i) --> 0.0f + 1.0f*i
csqrtf(-1.0f - 0.0f*i) --> 0.0f - 1.0f*i

In general, however, you shouldn't need to worry about negative zero.

1
  • Wouldn't it be better if the expression float negativeZero = -10.0e-30f * 10.0e-30f; rounded of to 0.0f and instead of -0.0f. If both positive and negative zero are same why not eliminate this ambiguity and keep only positive zero ? Another simple way of getting negative zero-: float neg=-0.00000000000000000001; printf("%f",neg);
    – Sreyan
    Aug 25, 2014 at 15:28
8

Yes zero can be signed but the standard requires positive and negative zero to test as equal

5

There are a couple of simple arithmetic operations that result in a negative zero answer (at least on the i386/x64/ARMv7/ARMv8 systems I tested it on) :

  • -1 * 0
  • 0 / -1

These caught me by surprise when I was writing an optimiser to simplify arithmetic expressions. Optimising "a = b * 0" to "a = 0" will result in the wrong answer (+0) if b happens to be negative (correct answer is -0).

2

Yes, float does have a negative zero, but no, you don't have to worry about this when comparing floating-point values.

Floating-point arithmetic is defined to work correctly on special cases.

11
  • Many compilers turn == on FP values into memory compare. Feb 23, 2011 at 19:34
  • 3
    @David: if they don't take account of negative zero in doing so, that should be reported as a bug to the compiler vendor. Feb 23, 2011 at 19:41
  • 2
    @David: Sure, but those languages don't count. =P Feb 23, 2011 at 19:52
  • 1
    @David: I'm shocked to find someone doing FE modeling and not using fortran, so I admit my curiosity: what language/compiler are you using that doesn't respect IEEE-754? Feb 23, 2011 at 21:45
  • 1
    @David: Interesting. I still think that behavior is worth registering a complaint with your compiler vendor, especially if they manage to be IEEE-754 compliant in other regards. Is there some strange historical reason for Delphi taking that approach? Feb 23, 2011 at 21:55
1

Yes, floats have negative zero just like other IEEE floating point types such as double (on systems with IEEE floating point). There is an example here in Octave of how to create them; the same operations work in C. The == operator treats +0 and -0 the same, though, and so negative zeros do not break that type of comparison.

2
  • is that the Octave == operator to which you refer? Feb 23, 2011 at 19:40
  • @David: The C ==, but Octave should do the same. Feb 23, 2011 at 19:41
0

You should exercise caution when doing equality comparisons using floats. Remember, you're trying to represent a decimal value in a binary system.

Is it safe to check floating point values for equality to 0?

If you must compare floating point values I would suggest you use some kind of tolerance that is acceptable to you float1 <= toleranceVal && float1 >= toleranceVal2 or multiply by some factor of ten and cast as an integer. if (!(int)(float1 * 10000)) { .. some stuff .. }

1
  • decimal/binary is not the issue, its representability/precision which is not the same thing Feb 23, 2011 at 20:13
0

Yes you can have a +0 and -0 and those are different bit patterns (should fail the equality test). You should never use == with float, certainly not IEEE float. < or > are fine. There are many other SO questions and discussions on this topic, so I wont get into it here.

7
  • +0 and -1? you didn't mean that I think Feb 23, 2011 at 19:40
  • 2
    -1 Equality goes further than comparing bits. And, in fact, -0 and +0 are defined to be equal. Jun 7, 2011 at 16:39
  • fair enough, a quick sample program confirms that gcc produces equality between -0 and +0. Doesnt mean you cant have a -0, the original question, and doesnt mean that it is a good idea to use an equal comparison with float.
    – old_timer
    Jun 7, 2011 at 17:13
  • do you have a reference where -0 and +0 are defined to be equal? thanks.
    – old_timer
    Jun 7, 2011 at 17:15
  • Although negative zero and positive zero are generally considered equal for comparison purposes, some programming language relational operators and similar constructs might or do treat them as distinct.
    – old_timer
    Jun 7, 2011 at 17:16
0

-lm has the signbit() function available to indicate if a value is negative (including -0)

0

this float1 == 0.0f is never really a safe comparison.

if you have something like

float x = 0.0f;
for (int i = 0; i < 10; i++) x += 0.1f;
x -= 1.0f;
assert (x == 0.0f);

it will fail even though it is seemingly supposed to be 0.

1
  • this answer is relevant to the question that inspired mine. Not mine though.
    – tenfour
    Feb 23, 2011 at 19:36

Your Answer

By clicking “Post Your Answer”, you agree to our terms of service and acknowledge that you have read and understand our privacy policy and code of conduct.

Not the answer you're looking for? Browse other questions tagged or ask your own question.